We have all been in the situation where we felt stressed about finding a specific place, be it in a new city or a new place. Of course, navigation at this point becomes a stressful experience but have you ever imagined it to be otherwise – perhaps an enjoyable experience as if you are taking a nice walk? At Dreamwaves, Hugo Furtado and his team use Audio Augmented Reality to make navigation easier – all you need is the waveOut app and your headphones.
Hugo, tell us a bit about yourself and how the idea of Dreamwaves was born
As a kid, I always wanted to open up all the toys, dismantle them, and put them back together. And, so it is hardly any surprise that I ended up studying electrical engineering later on. However, I do not consider myself a hardcore engineer, as I liked to explore other areas after completing my degree. For example, I enjoyed working in a small company, doing projects with other teams, and talking to different people. This, in turn, led me to move away from Portugal and work at CERN – which was a fantastic opportunity to meet many like-minded people from different countries.
Later on, I realised that I wanted to do something related to medical imaging because I love images. I therefore started my PhD for augmented reality for surgery, so that is one of the first things related to Dreamwaves and how my passion for Augmented Reality began. I focused on creating a system for visualising catheters inside of the human body during cardiac surgery. This was a real eye-opener as I realised that one could use augmented reality to create digital content on top of the real world to help people doing their tasks.
Besides imaging, another aspect that connects me with Dreamwaves is sound. I have been listening to a lot of music ever since I can remember. I am passionate about cinema, soundtracks of movies, and sound design. This inspired me to build my small home studio for recordings where I did some sound design for short films. This is a big thing to combine both imaging and sound, which led me to do augmented reality but in audio. And, this is precisely how Dreamwaves came to be. I knew about this technique to use spatial audio to create 3D sound with only regular headphones. My thought was that this is amazing, and the rest is history.
Could you walk us through how spatial audio navigation works?
The story I like to tell is that if you are home and cannot find your phone, you would ask somebody to call you and by this, you know immediately where your phone is. It rings, and you know that you cannot see it, but you can hear it, and eventually, you move towards the sound.
That is navigation as you were first in a specific spot, and now you find yourself in a different one. This is precisely what we do. Instead of having an actual loudspeaker making a sound, we have a virtual sound. And, by following a virtual sound, you do not have to stress about looking at the map but follow a virtual system.
*To learn more about the technology, click here for more details.
This sounds very interesting. Who are your customers?
Officially we were founded in 2019, but I had already began experimenting with 3D sound design previously. I was not aiming back then to solve any problem and therefore did not have a use case. But, somehow I felt I would like to have a business revolving around this topic. We got into an incubator, and then we took the idea of using the technology as a form of navigation for blind people and developed a whole concept.
We also knew that the application of easy navigation could extend its scope to include other user groups such as the elderly, who can use the technology to become more independent. Other examples include migrants or anybody new in town that find it challenging to get around due to language barriers – we can all relate to having seen streets with funky long names or different alphabets.
So, in essence, we are motivated to use this technology to make someone’s life easier and better by using navigation that is not dependent on letters of the street and viewing a map. Instead, our navigation system works via audio and provides intuitive navigation, which could also be relevant for bike riders as they are not dependent on viewing the screen for directions.
What is your business model?
The idea is to have a subscription model. So, what we do is we use a freemium model. You can use the app a few times a month and it is for free. But if it brings you real value, and you want to use it every day, you pay a monthly subscription. Although governments also fund some of these technologies, they are only available for a specific population as not all governments have the resources to invest in these products. Our philosophy is that our product should be affordable and can be accessed by everyone irrespective of their nationality. That is why we also want to extend our user group so the freemium model can be sustainable. For this, we have to find the right balance between the added value and how to communicate it in such a way that the user recognises it.
What you do is definitely impact-driven. Do you feel there is a stigma attached to the words impact tech?
I have an opinion on this, and I also acknowledge that there are multiple answers to this question that one needs to talk about. In our case, taking the example of the visually impaired, we definitely need to put in a bigger effort to develop the product across different levels – app design, user interface, user experience, and testing all require three to five times more time than developing a regular app.
In the end, the whole process is very time consuming, and the amount of effort that we have put in is very difficult to monetise later on and make it sustainable. Essentially, you want to try to serve a population, which all requires some extra effort. And, I think that is what people may find difficult. Often people ask me how could I ask blind people to pay for our product? And, I answer in return that I want to give them the best product that does not contain advertisements. You can imagine that their sense of hearing is one of their most important senses, and I do not wish to contaminate it with more advertising. Instead, we want to offer an affordable price model. We know that there are lots of companies that work with getting users and showing advertisements. But, we at Dreamwaves have a clear reason for not treading this path.
Also, we do not wish to collect data for monetisation. We would only use user data to improve their routes and our algorithms but not share it with any other third party. We consider this as our niche and something that is part of our philosophy – people are not products. And having such values can be difficult for impact founders. But, I think we can be a profitable business because we are creating value for society – these groups would like to pay for something that brings them real value. And then for me it is perfectly okay to make a business out of it.
Could you tell us about your research approach?
We have three areas of research, which is challenging at times, but then this is how it is. The first area is researching good and precise localisation, as our product is dependent on this factor, and this is where our expertise lies.
The second research area is spatial audio, which is a vast topic. And, for this topic, we cooperate with universities and other companies. So, this is perfect for us as we will be doing use-cases and prototypes cooperating with the universities doing the fundamental research. The core of the research is to make sure the audio feels natural to you. And, developing this over time is going to have a massive impact on us in the future.
The third research area is usability – mainly accessible user interaction in mobiles. We do not approach this topic as a real research topic, but we still need to investigate how blind and visually impaired users behave. But, this again is a normal step a startup usually takes. For example by drawing insights from different focus groups, namely the elderly or visually impaired .
What were your biggest challenges and your best moments so far?
Apart from the technical challenges, the biggest challenge for me is the team. How do we make sure the team is united, that everyone is happy and loves what they are doing? These are all important questions for me. It is clear that everyone loves their part, but it is essential that we connect and interact to fulfil our common goal. And, as the team is growing this part becomes harder to maintain. I think this is an exciting challenge, which requires great care because solving this challenge will only help us become a closely-knit and motivated team.
Regarding our best moments, there were many, but one that stood out for me was when we tested our product with a blind person who then told us that it felt like seeing again, this was very rewarding for me. This person once had their vision until a certain age, so they knew what it felt like to see.
Do you have any habits that help you stay on top of things?
We have grown a lot as a team recently, and we are going to grow even more. However, now with the pandemic, we are interacting in a way we did not do before. And for this, we have to define some artificial habits to make sure the team functions and remain on top of things. Both are challenging and always work in progress.
Another crucial aspect is prioritisation. I do not think we have a system, but I can say that we have learned to verbalise things better over time. An interesting thing about prioritising personally is that the work is infinite for a startup founder. Therefore, it is essential to consciously distinguish tasks we should do and not do – and this can be hard at times. But, I think this is a key part to succeed and keep the company running.
On that note, do you have any advice for founders who are just beginning their journey?
I think having focus is the most important aspect. Especially as a startup, there is this delicate balance to strike when managing tasks by asking what is the most critical area to focus on now? Because there will be so many things you will need to do, so your focus is very important here. And, bear in mind that you cannot solve all problems immediately.
Another thing is also not to give up easily because there will be many times when things do not work as planned. Having said that, it is also essential to realise the point when to give up, but the key is not to get so disappointed by the ups and downs. The startup journey is characterised by many highs and lows. That is part of life, and learning to endure it is necessary. Because I think if you are really passionate about your idea, honest with yourself, and you are solving a real problem, then you have a high chance of succeeding.
What we also do is to talk to many people, not only our mentors but other people from different backgrounds, and gather their opinions to see if our product works. When doing so, remember to remain humble. If someone were to tell you that what you are doing makes no sense, then really, it is a sign to take a step back and evaluate and see whether it applies to you because in the end it is your call anyways.
Where do you see Dreamwaves in the next few years?
Currently, there is a big trend in Augmented Reality for consumer applicability. At Dreamwaves, we dream of becoming known as a reference navigator, meaning people use our technology to navigate and learn about places in a calm and relaxed way instead of a stressful way.
Any books you would like to recommend?
Since the beginning of my startup journey, my reference book has been The Art of the Start by Guy Kawasaki. His pragmatism resonates a lot with me, and it straightforwardly covers every important topic from negotiation to organisation. It is a highly recommendable read.